DarrylB 2003-12-18 08:07
Hey all,
Ok, im needing two lcd panels. DVI, no speakers, and need to be ergonomic.
Also, they must be refresh rates of LESS THAN 20MS. My use for this is: web design, programming (lotta text), games/movies.
Anyone got recommendations and web url for reviews of monitors? tomshardware didnt give me great ideas....
Thanks!
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Barton 2003-12-18 08:57
Darryl,
I noticed in my January 2004 issue of Computer Shopper that Viewsonic has 16ms response times on their pro (VP) series monitors.
After checking their website, I found that teh VP171 (17") and VP210 (20") both offer the 16ms response times. I have 3 VP181's and Viewsonic shows their response times as 30ms.
Check out all the specs on Viewsonic's website.
Barton
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Barton 2003-12-18 09:02
Forgot to mention, you can pick these up at ZipZoomFly.com (formerly Googlegear.com). Excellent company. I've purchased a lot of equipment from them. Second Day shipping is included in the price and no tax if you live outside California.
If you want to shop around some more, search for the model number in Google.
Good luck!
Barton
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Christian Studer 2003-12-18 19:01
I use a VP171 as my primary monitor, very nice display. Also very well suited for multi-monitor setups due to the thin bezel.
Christian Studer - www.realtimesoft.com
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Martyn Iles 2003-12-18 22:10
<20ms aint everything and can be very misleading.
See tomshardware for reasons and reviews.
I'm using a pair of Hyundai Q17 which are excellent and fully capable of video and games :)
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DarrylB 2003-12-18 22:43
Yeah the Hyundai Q17 were recommended by Tom if i recall... well, they were the MOST recommended. LCD's are still in there infancy as fart as im concerned...
-Darryl
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Riptide 2003-12-20 07:41
Don't let yourself mislead by the technical specs for TFT response times! Theres is no prescribed measurement procedure for such attributes.
It strongly depends on the course of the response time over the colour gamut. Typically this is influenced by the panel type. IPS or S-IPS at 25ms is a whole different story than MVA or PVA at 25ms!
16ms is currently only available with TN panels, which have poor grayscale resolution and average contrast ratios and viewing angles. There is exactly one S-IPS panel (from LG) supporting 16ms.
If you want to avoid ghosting and streaking don't get a 25ms PVA/MVA panel TFT. But i also can't recommend 16ms TN panels!
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ecarlson 2003-12-20 14:33
Riptide: What do all these different things mean? Is there a web site that explains the different types of LCD panels? ALso, how do you know what type a given panel is?
- Eric www.InvisibleRobot.com
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mac 2003-12-24 05:05
u should know that the vp171 doesn't have true 24-bit color because uses that AU Optronic LCD, instead its 18-bit with dithering as stated in Tom's review.
thats why i ended up buying a samsung 173T, color is much nicer. though i'm stuck with 25ms, i don't notice any problems playing games or watching movies ;)
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Tydfan 2003-12-28 12:02
If you are still looking for good monitors, I just purchased two NEC Multisync 1760NX. The response time is rated at 16ms, and as far as gaming they are beautiful...no ghosting at all. These are really outstanding monitors.
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DarrylB 2003-12-29 04:15
Yes, im still looking... I was actually looking at the NEC monitors myself... They seemed to be relatively well rated... How are watching DVD's, movies, etc on them?
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Eddy 2004-01-05 07:20
Hi guys..
I also also in a dilemma..sigh,
I cannto choose between Samsung 173T and NEC 1760NX
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DarrylB 2004-01-06 03:13
I was reading up, and i heard that the NEC has bad viewing angles. But i have yet to confirm. Sadly, no local stores have this LCD for me to verify.
In the end, i need a LCD that will play movies/games, and i can work on it for many hours at a time (webdesign, coding, etc). Its an all-use LCD. NEC seems to be the closest to what i want, but Viewsonic makes a nice LCD too... I just wish the NEC had more ergonomics...
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DarrylB 2004-01-08 23:58
Eddy, Have you decided?
I will be ordering mine within the next 1-2mths. Im waiting for the new Athlon AMD 64FX to come out, and version 2 of the mobo's before i build my new system, and these monitors are with the new build ;)
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DarrylB 2004-01-09 01:04
http://www.modthebox.com/review280_3.shtml
THey have a review on a new samsung, its very impressive, for movies and all. Only prob i saw, was they said it had SLIGHT shadowing in halo. I wonder how bad....
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Riptide 2004-01-11 20:17
@ecarlson: Hi... well theres a good forum which explains all those things but its mostly german -> www.prad.de (they shoudl have english forums by now)
As for the panels... there are only few panel manufactures out there (LG, AU-Optronics, Samsung...). Usually the different TFT (not panel) manufacturers don't mention the used panel. But they tell you wether its an IPS or MVA Panel and than you can conclude who build it.
If you want a fast performing (and i wont state response times since they are misleading) don't go for samsung TFT since they use PVA Panels. Better try IPS/S-IPS. (Reference TFT in the 18" class is the NEC 1880SX despite its 33ms.)
Try asking urself how importent you judge the viewing angle of the monitor. As far as i know there no 17" monitor without TN-Panel (fastest response time, worst viewing angle). If that's no argument for you, great go fo an 17". Otherwise try enlarging your scope including the 18" class.
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ecarlson 2004-01-12 13:10
Thanks for the link and the info.
Personally I want at least a 19" LCD because I like to sit back, and when I do that, everything is too small on a 17" LCD panel at 1280x1024. I'll be waiting a while before I get an LCD, because the 19" displays are still a bit expensive these days.
Actually, if I find an awesome deal on a 15" 1024x768 LCD, I might buy one, to replace one of my 17" monitors. I would still eventually get a 19" LCD to be the primary monitor.
- Eric www.InvisibleRobot.com
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Riptide 2004-01-12 18:52
As for the 19" market... theres actually no existing IPS panel in this class, only PVA/MVA.
I'm mentioning that just in case response time behavior is major factor for you. There will be fist S-IPS panels in Q2 this year.
But anyways, the best is always a 'real-view' check at your local store to experience all the these cute TFTs life. I used a 19"TFT and was quite satisfied, but i'm also no hardcore gamer.
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ecarlson 2004-01-13 13:04
Thanks. I don't play 3D games, but I do sometimes watch TV on my computer, so that is basically the only time screen response would make a difference.
- Eric www.InvisibleRobot.com
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ecarlson 2004-01-13 13:12
Riptide: Which panel types are best for color reproduction, like for photo editing?
Also, which types have a more consistent coloring and brightness as you move your head around? It's difficult to edit photos well if the levels or colors change when you change your viewing angle.
Finally, which types are best for viewing by lots of people at the same time, like when you have a bunch of people standing around and you are showing them something on your monitor.
- Eric www.InvisibleRobot.com
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Riptide 2004-01-13 20:30
Well... concerning the colour reproduction (in terms of colour accuracy/purity) IPS/S-IPS Panels are most suited. MVA/PVA also produce splendid colours (especially recieved this way by the viewer due the panels possible high contrast ratios) but lacking some accuray over their IPS contenders.
So far there are only few TFTs targeted at the professional audience (Eizo CG18 / CG21). As average user you can still go for any S-IPS =)
Today TFT can have max viewing angles of up to 178 degrees (MVA/PVA/S-IPS). This is really comparabale to CRTs.
(1) If you got a bunch of people sitting around your TFT you won't experience to much problems (unless you got TN-Panel which are know to have low viewing angles). Everyone can at least see what going on.
The viewing angle affects contrast and thereby colour purity.
(2) That means even if you can still see the picture contents if you are looking from the side, the colours will change the more your turn away from the panels front. But in practice you really won't experience any drastic effect if you just move your head around. S-IPS Panels are in general not better than MVA/PVA concerning this issue, but you got some Panel variants among the S-IPS panels which can handle this better than MVA/PVAs can. ( e.g Dualdomain IPS, see Eizo TFTs)
(despite it's korean they got soem nice shots illustrating (1) and (2) http://www.monitor4u.co.kr/review/review4u/content.asp?tbl=lcd&idx=521&p_idx=449&page=4 )
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Greg 2004-01-14 04:58
The New Iiyama ProLite E431S
16ms and apparently good for games but not so good for DVD.
http://www.pcpro.co.uk/reviews/reviews_story.php?id=50462
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ecarlson 2004-01-14 13:49
Riptide: Thanks. In that lower sets of photos, the smaller of the 2 monitors looks far better in the off-angle shots. Which monitor is which?
- Eric www.InvisibleRobot.com
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Riptide 2004-01-15 23:29
The smaller one is the Eizo CG18 (dual-domain IPS) which is aimed at the graphics professional.
Color purity, color gamut and viewing angle are top notch. But it's absolutely no gaming TFT =) (visible tearing and ghosting)
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ecarlson 2004-01-17 08:59
If it's bad for games, is it also bad for playing videos? Maybe I need 2 different types of LCD panels instead of 2 of the same type.
- Eric www.InvisibleRobot.com
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Riptide 2004-01-18 18:14
Most games are played with much more fps than the playback of DVD/Video (remember NTSC is 30fps and PAL only 25fps). Therefore DVDs don't require as much respons time as games do.
If you go for a dual-monitor setup I would strongly recommend the same TFTs. Even though the viewing angle on the pictures (see link) are not equal for both models I can only say that the one with less angle performance is still very good. I think you would still be quiet happy if sitting in front of this TFT =)
Maybe take the knowledge you now have and look at some models in a local store.... check out those viewing angles and the contrasts you percieve. Tech. spec. can only give you a hint about the actual performance.
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ecarlson 2004-01-19 13:32
I have been looking at LCD panels in stores. There is certainly a big variation in how different monitors perform under varying conditions. They seem to be getting better overall though.
- Eric www.InvisibleRobot.com
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Mark Weeden 2004-01-20 12:38
I'm thinking of purchasing a 17" Sony HX monitor. Can anyone tell me anything about it - image quality etc. One big draw card for me is that here in Austrlia Sony offer a zero dead pixel guarantee with the X and HX monitors.
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